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whatnitrus

WhatNitrous

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ausf said:
I was talking more about classic adventure games. King's Quest, Monkey Island, Conquests of Camelot. Could you fight and stuff like that? You know, make a game out of it? No, you point and clicked, and then had to repeat the entire game again because you didn't bring the right amount of coins at the start. The game wasn't a game, and did not respect your time.

I understand some people liked them, but if the only way to complete them was to use a walkthrough, then you might as well just read the walkthrough and skip the game.
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Now your insulting persona too :LOL:

I'm kidding dude, just busting balls...but in truth I used a guide just for the demo of P3 Reload in case I carried over my data.

I get what your saying honestly...but it depends on the game...its also why I added a built in walkthrough for our game as well as a kinetic story mode option heh.
 
ausf

Ausf

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ivo-ivic said:
No, you didn't need walkthroughs for the good ones. Most puzzles were based on (game) logic, but there was some pixel-hunting because of low resolutions.
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When I searched for Conquests of Camelot coins, this is the AI response:

"In the Sierra game Conquest of Camelot, players need to choose the correct coins for various tasks, including paying for safe passage, hiring mercenaries, and purchasing items. Some tasks require specific amounts of copper, silver, or gold coins. For example, one section of the game requires a minimum of 5 copper, 7 silver, and 4 gold coins."

The thing is, you have no idea about this before you set off, and you can't go back, and no one has change. It's just a complete waste of time. Either you had a walkthrough telling you exactly how many of each coin you needed, or you failed repeatedly, repeatedly repeating the game, until you worked it out for yourself. If Sierra, the king of adventure games, wasn't a maker of good games, then who was?

Some games were supposed to be funny. Some were just puzzle games, where you do puzzles, but forcing you to restart hours of game over something so ridiculous is not fun. Also, these games were reviewed very highly. I just thought they sucked. Same with Monkey Island's fights. Matching insults with counter insults? Why couldn't I just fight them with sword skill?
 
ivo-ivic

silent_passenger

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ausf said:
The thing is, you have no idea about this before you set off, and you can't go back, and no one has change. It's just a complete waste of time. Either you had a walkthrough telling you exactly how many of each coin you needed, or you failed repeatedly, repeatedly repeating the game, until you worked it out for yourself. If Sierra, the king of adventure games, wasn't a maker of good games, then who was?
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Yeah, that one was their bad, but most of the time, you could go back because point-and-click adventures were basically free-roams before free-roam games. My favourite Sierra franchise was Gabriel Knight, and I never had any complaints about it. but if I would call any developer the king of adventures...
ausf said:
Some games were supposed to be funny. Some were just puzzle games, where you do puzzles, but forcing you to restart hours of game over something so ridiculous is not fun. Also, these games were reviewed very highly. I just thought they sucked. Same with Monkey Island's fights. Matching insults with counter insults? Why couldn't I just fight them with sword skill?
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Yup... Lucas Arts. Monkey Island is great - no dissing! And just a simple sword fighting wouldn't be so much fun! Don't be Grouchy Smurf.
819028-grouchy_large.jpg
 
whatnitrus

WhatNitrous

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ausf said:
Matching insults with counter insults? Why couldn't I just fight them with sword skill?
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I actually sort of enjoyed this aspect of the Suikoden series (except the pahn fight...god), where the phrase they said before an attack gave you an idea of which choice to make in a rock paper scissors kind of method...it was done for one on one duels which were almost a mini game--some though, like the one between the MC and Pahn I mentioned above were extroidinarily difficult due to the damage that he did if you guessed wrong...and that fight determined if he rejoined your party and you could get the true ending with all 107 stars of destiny.

Even then, I enjoyed it as a unique challenge in a strategy sense that wasnt required most of the time for battles or recruiting, I doubt I would feel the same about the coin aspect you mentioned or if those were the main way battle was handled at all times...i'm not much for repeating games and thats the only reason I use guides at all to get the good ending in one run.
 
ausf

Ausf

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whatnitrus said:
Thats the best depiction of how I imagine ausf anyone could have posted :ROFLMAO:
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I'm much lazier than angry as a Smurf, but that just happens to be one of the things that annoyed me. A big part of it is that my expectations and reality were too far apart. This was all before the internet, when people thought making overly tedious games, and making you restart the game over and over again was a good idea.
 
whatnitrus

WhatNitrous

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ausf said:
I'm much lazier than angry as a Smurf, but that just happens to be one of the things that annoyed me. A big part of it is that my expectations and reality were too far apart. This was all before the internet, when people thought making overly tedious games, and making you restart the game over and over again was a good idea.
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Grouchy is actually considered 'serious' smurf and thats how I took that reference.

Are you kidding me? Now they have Multiplayer with 4 maps and fourty thousand players making those maps fun, forget the double play (hard and nightmare) difficulty trophies now seemingly a default strategy for all single player games...or worse nightmare and kill me please difficulty which is unlocked by beating nightmare, which you cant do until you've played the game at least once on another difficulty lol.

As a completionist I think the games have gotten worse for SP, and all the online based garbage or things like sailing in AC Black Flag (underwater or ocean based collectibles in particular) are much worse than them just making you restart.

A note on this though is that I was a console douche most of my gamer life after DOS and it was only when PS3 went digital that it truly got terrible in my opinion, PC games had much more variety from smaller devs that I never played in those days, I havent heard of alot of the titles you and ivo are talking about honestly...i'm still playing catch up on alot of older PC titles which is nearly impossible with my backlog lol.
 
whatnitrus

WhatNitrous

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ausf said:
Speaking of starting over and over, Rogue. That was a game where it was fine to start over. You explored, fought, died, and restarted. They didn't just end your hours long gaming session because you chose the wrong amount of coins when you began.
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Remember my post about Pacific Drive? Ya...fuck that idea :ROFLMAO: I dont even want to play it once lmao.

Imagine restarting minecraft (wagon-craft?) ninety times whenever you died. №
 
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ausf

Ausf

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whatnitrus said:
As a completionist I think the games have gotten worse for SP
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That's the problem. Feeling like you have to complete it, rather than choosing to play again because you want to. I played KCD1 multiple times, even though it's a story based game, and I knew the story in and out. It was fun. They made a hardcore mode, and I refused to play it.

The same with Battletech. I enjoyed the game's story. Then they made this career mode where you're supposed to get points by doing all this tedious crap. I didn't bother. I don't care. It's not fun. I did not get all the pointless achievements.

Battletech also made a big deal about using the smaller mechs, and how sometimes you needed a scalpel, and not a hammer. They were wrong. If your hammer isn't working, you just need a bigger hammer. If you maxed out pilot skill, you could go as fast, so there was absolutely no reason to use the smaller ones, unless you were a hipster.
 
whatnitrus

WhatNitrous

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ausf said:
That's the problem. Feeling like you have to complete it, rather than choosing to play again because you want to. I played KCD1 multiple times, even though it's a story based game, and I knew the story in and out. It was fun. They made a hardcore mode, and I refused to play it.
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Again this came from my console era...and I did it to prevent bankruptcy, I didnt socialize on the network same as steam and really hated other social sites (still do--here aside), so I basically sat home on disability gaming or programming (more gaming at this point) pretty much all day everyday, rather than having a backlog I couldnt find enough games I actually enjoyed...so I ended up with the need to complete them just to extend the playtime and not go bankrupt buying more digital trash (particularly NIS on ps3) that claimed to be RPGs but was in fact more of a god grinder game with 7 small zones and then you repeated with higher levels...not my idea of an RPG any more than mass genre was.

Back then I was pretty much RPG biased, with assassins creed being a rare exception and a few other games, my back was too fucked up to use portable gaming systems and I had absolutely no money beyond bills...so it just became my routine to keep myself busy really and it stuck with me.

I also do it in RPGs in case I replay them (when you gain extra incentive), but I rarely end up replaying them...I have such a good memory I can cite them line for line most of the time and it really kills story based games, especially RPGs.

I actually had a hatred for racing back then and barely found open world or adventure games I truly enjoyed, so it was a pretty slim selection to choose from even when I could afford it.
 
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